Power bills

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Greynomad
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Re: Power bills

Post by Greynomad »

It seems the answer is to go completely off-grid…
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Busman
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Re: Power bills

Post by Busman »

Hnag on, lets pull this apart bit by bit.

Firstly I am not recommending any product, posted for interest and knowledge only.

Secondly, just 2 posts ago, you recommend buying batteries instead of buying power, now that seems to have gone by the board.

Thirdly, maintenance. You maintain your solar system, after any warranty period, youself, nothing unusual there. Same as all the parts, inverters etc.

Fourth, these batteries are not being flogged as part of a new installation with attendant FIT's, but as an add on for existing solar systems

Fifth, they are modular AC connected units (have inverter on board) making install very easy.New ay of doing things ?

Sixth, Can you guantee that if I was to purchase one of these batteries as an add on to an existing solar system, that any power from it will be exported to the grid ?
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T1 Terry
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Re: Power bills

Post by T1 Terry »

Greynomad wrote: Sat Sep 24, 2022 12:09 am It seems the answer is to go completely off-grid…
Ideally, but grid back up and over flow feed back to grid is another option. With going off grid, the authorities loose the powers to demand anything, including following their standards to the letter and anyone working on the system mush be licensed and pay money to the Clean Energy Council for the privilege of working on any solar and back to grid installations.

Stupid things like the solar isolation switch at the end of each solar array, they catch fire and who is going to climb on the roof to turn the solar off is there is a problem? The safer way to do it is to run the cabling down to the solar control box and install a dedicated DC double pole circuit breaker there. If the solar actually needs to be worked on, the switch at the end of the array isn't going to help, that only disconnects the solar array from the wiring running the rest of the way down to the solar control box.

The fact you can't reuse solar panels, if you need to lift the solar panels off to do a roof repair or an extension, you can't get a "licensed Clean Solar member" technician to reinstall them, there are rules within the act that allow it to be done, but the unwritten rule is not to do it but rather only install new Tier 1 panels and all cabling must be replaced .....

The closed shop insanity goes on and on .......

With the authorities looking at gouging even more $$ so they can again "upgrade" the infrastructure, read replace worn out out of date equipment at someone else's expense, it makes less and less sense to remain connected to the grid if you have sufficient area to mount a solar array that can power your needs and back it up with battery storage and an electric vehicle that can add extra storage over night.

T1 Terry
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T1 Terry
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Re: Power bills

Post by T1 Terry »

Busman wrote: Sat Sep 24, 2022 3:12 pm Hnag on, lets pull this apart bit by bit.

Firstly I am not recommending any product, posted for interest and knowledge only.

Secondly, just 2 posts ago, you recommend buying batteries instead of buying power, now that seems to have gone by the board.

Thirdly, maintenance. You maintain your solar system, after any warranty period, youself, nothing unusual there. Same as all the parts, inverters etc.

Fourth, these batteries are not being flogged as part of a new installation with attendant FIT's, but as an add on for existing solar systems

Fifth, they are modular AC connected units (have inverter on board) making install very easy.New ay of doing things ?

Sixth, Can you guantee that if I was to purchase one of these batteries as an add on to an existing solar system, that any power from it will be exported to the grid ?
Sorry Bill, I didn't intend to suggest you were recommending this product. The Solar Battery Group are here in SA as well and the amazing price offered on TV has quite a few conditions, basically the ones I listed, plus a few more so the installation of your battery is for some reason not a "standard" install.
Insurance might be an issue with these grid connected batteries as well, a lot have gone up in flames.

I'm not recommending grid connected battery storage systems, as far as I see it, that's just asking to be had even worse that the way you were had with the original solar installation. If you are considering installing a back to the grid storage battery add on, read the fine print very carefully, with a legal person who understands the twisted jargon contracts are written in, if it means the energy stored in your battery is not exposed to the power provider grabbing it "when needed" ......

T1 Terry
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Peter and Sandra
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Re: Power bills

Post by Peter and Sandra »

We've got a Tesla Powerwall 2 that was installed at the end of last year, we've not had to pay a bill since but are in credit every time, that might change in the current quarter due to low solar due to ongoing overcast and wet weather and using the a/c for heating through winter but even with that we still hold our own most of the time.
We signed no contracts other than for the actual install and the electricity provider is probably not even aware we have a battery.
I can control (that capability is curently turned off) whether it discharges to the grid and it has never done so looking at data provided live by the gateway. I can also control through the phone app the power priorities between usage, solar, battery and grid if required, I can also set the maximum discharge point and most other parameters. We have a 5kw solar system, more would be good ;-))
It is quite uncanny in a blackout as until the gateway sends me a text we are usually unaware that the grid has gone down.
We had the battery installed under a NSW regional subsidy that ceased last june of an interest free loan. As the monthly loan repayments were much less than our lowest quarterly electricity bill before any price rises it seemed like a reasonable deal and the battery is guaranteed to have at least 80% of capacity at ten years of age or it will be replaced with a new one.
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pet-els
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Re: Power bills

Post by pet-els »

Q. If you are off grid compleatly, do the power companies still charge for wires etc that goes past you property?
I remember that if you owned vacant land you still got water rates, power rates as it was available even if you did not use it.

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Busman
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Re: Power bills

Post by Busman »

I believe they will charge an access fee but if enough people refuse to pay it, what are they going to do ?

T1, no way I would buy one of these, with what I have learnt over the years I would build one, but not tell Ergon or whatever. I have all the infrastructure already in place to use the battery in VP instead of the grid, just need time enough to add the third inverter so as to be able to run everything on our 3 phase system. Down at the moment with flu, first time I bothered with a flu shot, a few months ago, Still seems a bloody bad dose, won't bother with it next year.
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Dot
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Re: Power bills

Post by Dot »

I will be divorcing Gman so I become a ward of the state and get put into a dementia unit, put the house into my niece's name = no bills at all. :lol: :lol:
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T1 Terry
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Re: Power bills

Post by T1 Terry »

pet-els wrote: Sun Sep 25, 2022 8:52 am Q. If you are off grid compleatly, do the power companies still charge for wires etc that goes past you property?
I remember that if you owned vacant land you still got water rates, power rates as it was available even if you did not use it.

PeterH
They can charge you for the water pipes passing the property, that is because the water infrastructure is still govt owned.
The power lines, generators and service providers are no longer owned by the govt, they sold them off. You can not be forced to pay a private company that has not actually provided a service, only the govt can do that :lol: If you are still connected to the grid, in other words the main fuses are still in place so you could pull power from the network if you wanted to, then you have to pay that poles and wires connection fee, but if there is no service provider actually providing you a service, then there is no charge payable.

I questioned a bloke from SA Power that gave a talk about how the SA Power Network was being future proofed to allow for the coming EV surge, their new pricing structure and the new battery at the house system.
He made it quite clear:
Any time someone wanted to go off the grid they were happy to do so, but you might wait quite some time to get reconnected
EV batteries could not be used as a storage source to sell back to the grid and qualify for the reduced power price offer .... the reason was there were no guarantees the EV would still be plugged in when they needed the power .......

He was asked if it were possible to block the house battery from being drained by the network and a few members mentioned they could turn the access to the network off in their app .... his reply was, sure you can turn it off in your app ..... not actually saying you could block the network from draining the battery .... after further questioning about how the network accessed the stored power in the battery and the reply was via a signal sent down the power lines or through the smart meter reader boxes being run out throughout the network here ..... then someone asked about the fact the network was locked out of the battery via their app .... he gave a sly smile and said, if you are connected to the network, we have that access when needed .....

Other states might be different, but I doubt it, if one state can get away with it then I see no reason why the other states wouldn't be doing the same .....

T1 Terry
A person may fail many times, they only become a failure when they blame someone else John Burrows
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Busman
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Re: Power bills

Post by Busman »

So it seems to me that the best way to go is to put in a solar system and battery without bothering to tell them ? In our case we already have a changeover switch in place, that would block them from accessing any power.
I would guess they use a frequency signal to tell inverters to send out battery power, same sort of thing they send to Zellweger devices to turn on off peak hot water systems ?
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